Sippie Wallace interview (part 1)

Duration: 1:45:54

The first part of an interview with the Texas-born Blues singer Sippie Wallace (née Beulah Belle Thomas, 1898-1986), conducted by John Norris and Marlene Norris on Oliver’s behalf, with Clarence Blair also present for the recording. Note that a full transcript of this interview is available.

Side 1:

[0:00:03] Interviewers introduce themselves. John Norris addresses Oliver directly. [0:01:00] Sippie Wallace talks about her family and upbringing in Houston, Texas. [0:03:10] Her father’s occupation, her parents’ meeting in Arkansas, and their ages at death. [0:04:50] How she came to play the piano, taught by a cousin who also supplied the instrument. More information about her older brother. The origin of the name ‘Sippie’. [0:09:35] Hearing ‘Crazy Blues’ by Mamie Smith and other female blues singers. How she started performing after separating from her first husband. Moving to Chicago after her mother’s death. [0:14:00] Recording ‘Shorty George’, which became a hit. Signing a five-year record contract. Experience of publicity in New York. Releasing new records every three months - ‘28 straight hits’. Switching label with her manager from OKeh to Victor. [0:18:50] How she came to have second thoughts about the blues and returned to the Church. Getting asked why she doesn’t make gospel records. Having to take care of herself as a widow (after the death of her second husband Matt Wallace). Her mother’s last sickness and remarrying in 1923. [0:23:40] About her brother Hersal Thomas, who she claims died aged 16 [actually 19]. Her next accompanist Cleo. [0:26:45 - tape cuts] More on Hersal. Moving with him to Detroit, and his death shortly afterwards in 1926. Burning everyone in the family. More about her brother George, who worked as a composer. How he died. [Tape cuts out.]

Side 2:

[0:35:29] More on Hersal’s illness (apparently from food poisoning) and Detroit. Sippie’s own experience of serious food poisoning. Working with church choirs. [0:44:10] Her strong-willed character. The strengths of her contralto singing voice. ‘Outsinging all of Michigan’ at a national singing convention. Singing competitively as a child. [0:51:45 - tape cuts] About her cousin Marie Felton, who taught her piano. Sings excerpt of gospel song ‘I Need Thee’. Having too many job offers to play in churches. Difficulties travelling around. [0:59:10] Asks interviewers whether she should perform blues again. [They encourage her to do so.] Risk of Church disapproval. The whereabouts of Ida Cox. About the gospel song ‘You must be born again’. [1:03:44] How Hersal learnt to play piano. The relative merits of her two brothers’ playing - Hersal’s influence on Fats Waller and boogie woogie. Sippie plays several musical examples at the piano. Sings excerpt from ‘Black Gal’, which Joe Pullum took from Hersal. [1:11:08] About George’s daughter Hociel Thomas, raised by Sippie’s mother. How Hociel’s child Buster died after an accident with a firecracker. Hociel’s other children - how she asked Sippie to look after them on her deathbed. [1:21:18 - tape cuts] Sippie discusses family photographs. J. Norris asks about the Houston pianists Scanlon [? - aka Skinny] Smith and Edgar Perry. How Hersal was a better player than Sugar Chile [Robinson]. About Johnny Calvin and his wife Cleo. [1:28:36] Norris asks about further pianists, ‘Snake’ and Andy Boy. Hociel’s work in nightclubs. About Bernice Edwards. Hersal naming a dance after Hociel. The mental illness of Hociel’s daughter Queen - hearing voices telling her to kill her children. [1:40:20] About ‘Muscle Shoal Blues’, ‘Up the Country Blues’, and ‘Caldonia Blues’. Sippie plays a rendition of ‘Up the Country’ at the piano. How George gave her $5,000 of the royalties he earned (from the song she had written).

Original file name: POAAAM - A19 [the significance of this reference number is unclear]

This tape has been inserted in the 'T' series after T10 because T12 is on the second side of the tape containing the second part of the interview. Although there was also originally a compilation tape labelled T11 (compiled by Francis Smith), Oliver recorded over it with a 1970 radio programme and other dubs (see POAAAM/3/1/7/9).

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